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04/24/2014

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Oliver

Another delusion is that nationality, culture or politics has anything to do with the disaster that is humankind. Just because the US and EU are in decline (CO2 levels changing 'modestly') and China, India and 'Other Non-OECD' are amid the excess of their own industrial revolution (CO2 emissions galloping ahead) doesn't make the net result any better, for anyone living anywhere. If the US economy was making things, rather than just pushing fake money around, CO2 would be on a steeper incline in the USA. And of course, a lot of the excessive shit that Americans consume is made in the regions where CO2 is replacing oxygen at fantastic rates. So it's pointless, fruitless and narrow-minded to single out who is responsible for emissions. Nostra culpa.

T.J.

Growing despair sounds about right.

Mike Roberts

Following on from Oliver's thoughts, it's also delusional of the powers in Denmark to think they can get off fossil fuels by 2050, without extracting themselves from the global economy.

Most certainly, Klein is delusional but that's all anyone has left; a delusion that humans can use their supposed intelligence to actually alter the characteristics of their own species.

I glanced through Klein's article looking for the example of how humans changed their nature in the past (as the subtitle included "humans have changed before and can change again") but couldn't find it. It seems as though she's delusional all round. It's still an interesting read though, academically.

Ben

Check this guy out fellas breaking down The Many Faces of Denial:

http://www.paulchefurka.ca/Denial.html

Dave Cohen

If you're keeping score...

Naomi Klein, published in The Guardian -- 1329 comments

Dave Cohen, self-published on DOTE -- 3 comments.

Certainly we can conclude that humanity has a very bright future indeed.

-- Dave

Brian

Obvious, yes.... but clearly not apparent.

Dave, you should know better than to simply count quantities. You have to normalize.

Naomi ... 1329/7 billion Flatlanders... .00001899%
Dave ... 4/a few hundred non-Flatlanders... .8% (assumes 500 or so of "us", possibly optimistic? ;-)

On a percentage basis, you generate something like 42,000 times the response rate! You squish her like a grape!

She is essentially ignored even in a land where only fantasy pablum can be digested. Perhaps the unconscious mind is doing something right in Flatland after all. ;-) Just sayin'.

Dave Cohen

Yes, Brian

On a normalized basis, I win hands down.

However, we might worry some about this ratio...

non-flatlanders/flatlanders

-- Dave

Charles

"that graph at the top very strongly suggests that humans are fundamentally unable to respond to the threat posed by anthropogenic climate change"

This chart suggests the same by showing CO2 concentrations increasing with each UN climate meeting over the last 20 years:
http://www.vancouverobserver.com/blogs/climatesnapshot/climate-failure-kyoto-doha-one-simple-chart

Funny thing, much delusional thinking results from assuming the future will be like the past.


Robert Arrington

Funny, I can't seem to help expecting the Jiminy Cricket "When You Wish Upon a Star" Pinnochio scene pop up at some point when I read Naomi Klein.

Obligatory Hope is the Tardigrade of modern problem solving. It also is damned near indestructible no matter how inhospitable the environment it encounters.

Apneaman

Naomi Klein, published in The Guardian -- 1329 comments

Dave Cohen, self-published on DOTE -- 3 comments.

You have to admit she is much hotter than you Dave.

Alexander Ač

Another thing is that Naomi Klein is still much less confused than 99 % of the rest of Flatlanders.

That puts the future of Humankind at stake :-/

(see trailer to the new Documentary 6):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qrw-fVADtv0

and also this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4KRWoubPEo

Alex

Jim

I have a proposal. All green activists should be given a free week's stay in Las Vegas. There, they'll see exactly what they're up against, as monkeys pull away on one-arm bandits like rats getting repeatedly shocked for that extra bit of cheese. There, they'll see a city carved out of the desert, completely devoid of authenticity, where modesty is a sin and excess is a virtue. They can compare the desire for that:
http://www.americanbar.org/newsletter/publications/gp_solo_magazine_home/gp_solo_magazine_index/gambling.html

As 4 out of every 5 Americans gamble, an inherently irrational pursuit triggered by built-in dopamine addictions and 'hope', to the desire for environmental action:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/167843/climate-change-not-top-worry.aspx

They could also study up about the 'Occupy Las Vegas' movement, which ended after "So many of them put their own desires above the goals of the movement."

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2012/feb/18/occupy-las-vegas-encampment-ends-backers-say-movem/

Naomi Klein has a lot of interesting things to say, but she's essentially stuck in an us vs. them mindset, the Flatland version of reality, and she's now pandering to a crowd of admirers, in whom obligatory hope is a tonic (and laxative).

A Farewell To Kings

Isn't the biggest delusion of all the one that says nuclear weapons keeps us safe???

I've been an AGW activist for 25 years and to this day my brother still threatens to never speak to me again lol

But there is one thing we can agree on. 25 years ago I didn't think nuclear power was such a great solution and 25 years ago he thought the UN was evil personified but today we agree that mod nukes (SMRs) are what we should be doing.

That means a global treaty, which may as well come via UNFCCC. I don't know how Naomi feels about nuclear but I have a pretty good idea where Vlad stands...

"Mitigation is a high speed train that needs to leave the station soon, and all of global society must get on board" Dr Pachauri, IPCC Chair, April2014

I think it will be a nuclear powered train. COP21 is the station. It departs 01JAN16.

Stewart Brand discusses the need for nuclear power in his 2008/9 book 'Whole Earth Discipline' (TEDtalk here:

http://www.ted.com/talk/stewart_brand_proclaims_4_environmental_heresies

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